The True Gospel vs the Simple Conditioned on Faith Gospel

People use the same name “Jesus” to describe their hope, but the person they describe is not the same person. Jesus in the Bible is described as a Savior of an elect called out people. What is called the “simple gospel” confuses everything by saying that Jesus also died ineffectively for other sinners who are not the sheep.

Is it sufficient for us to have implicit faith? Can we say: I don’t know who this Jesus is or what He did, but I trust Him, whoever He is and whatever He did. Can we be saved through trusting Jesus even when we don’t know which Jesus?

Is it converting faith for us to say that we accept as true what Jesus says, even though we do not know what Jesus says?

This would be a little bit like saying: I will do whatever you say to do to be saved. If you say work, I will work. If you say, make a decision, I will make a decision. The reason that people encourage this kind of simple implicit faith is that their faith is still in faith.

Instead of saying that Jesus died only for some and that this makes all the difference, they try to say INSTEAD that Jesus died for all “who believe in Him” and thus make the believing much more important than whatever it is that Jesus did.

After all, Jesus may or may not have done all that He did for everybody, we can’t say, we won’t say, so therefore we think we can trust Jesus and be agnostic about what He did or didn’t do.

This is because we think our faith is ultimately more important than the object of our faith. So our faith can have different objects, or no defined doctrinal object at all, and still we think our faith makes all the difference.

Faith in faith is not only about avoiding the offense of agreeing with Jesus about election. Faith in faith is a denial of election. It says that not election but faith is what matters. And to try to prove this, we are reminded that nobody knows if they are elect before they have faith. But faith in the gospel is not faith in one’s own election.

Faith in the gospel agrees first that Christ died as a substitute for the elect, and then faith in Christ agrees to trust for oneself this specific Christ and this specific way of salvation. Faith in the gospel agrees to exclude faith itself as the cause of salvation. Faith in the gospel agrees that faith itself is caused by what Christ did.

I Cor 15: “If Christ is not raised, your faith is vain.” It doesn’t matter how much faith you may have, if it is not objectively true that Jesus rose again. Your faith does not make Jesus rise from the dead. Nor does your lack of faith prove that Jesus did not rise from the dead. What Jesus did is done, regardless of your faith.

But what if we still argue that we “just” believe on Jesus, and we are neutral on this question if Jesus died for everybody or only for the elect? We must say there is only one Jesus, and we have no permission to believe in counterfeits.

A Jesus who died for everybody is a lot like Santa Claus: such a Jesus does not exist. There are many complicated things about Jesus that we do not understand, but one thing we can understand is that it is his death which saves. This means that everybody Jesus died for will be saved.

We understand that this means that everybody Jesus didn’t die for won’t be saved. We can’t be neutral about Jesus dying only for some, because we can’t be neutral about the real Jesus being the one who really saves. Our faith does not save. We must put our faith in the real Jesus or be still lost in our sins.

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3 Comments on “The True Gospel vs the Simple Conditioned on Faith Gospel”

  1. markmcculley Says:

    here’s this person who did a work
    and before you know if that work was for you,
    you must know and agree with the doctrine
    of what He did

    if you don’t know what the person did,
    you know neither the person
    nor if that person
    did anything for you

    commitment to the imperative
    to know the person cannot come
    before we know the indicative
    of what he got done

    since we are children of Abraham
    remember that Abraham knew what the seed had to do
    Abraham knew that he himself was not going
    to bring in the righteousness

    one result of election
    is submission to the doctrine of righteousness
    obtained by Christ for the elect alone
    and then imputed by God

    the test of the exodus out of the false gospel
    is not our testimony that
    “we know the person”
    the same person the crowd knows

    we are not called to a tragic imperative
    “to know the person” without knowing which person
    the sheep don’t follow the wrong
    person with the wrong doctrine

    i still want to know,
    how did a nice man like Jesus
    get himself killed
    if it was not the offense of his doctrine?

    yes, it’s fact He died
    but there are many possible options
    to explain that fact,
    and these doctrines divide

    they hated His doctrine
    so much they wanted Him dead
    but that was a long time ago

    and now the person comes into our hearts
    and now there is so much more immorality
    let’s worry about that
    and not be so anxious about
    Him being king of our doctrine

    let’s gather
    around a person
    they say, giving reasons
    why their doctrines are not doctrines
    and thank their god they are not
    like those doctrine persons

    for this Christ was born
    it’s the reason Christ came
    to satisfy the divine demand
    for death

    and without the doctrine of that death
    there will be no justifying
    the gospel itself the power of salvation

    • markmcculley Says:

      are we trying to defend Jesus so nobody notices that we don’t like Jesus either?
      stay unprepared, don’t try defend yourself by defending Jesus

      Jesus was lifted up the cross for the forgiveness of my sins

      Luke 21: 12 But before all these things, they will lay their hands on you and persecute you. They will hand you over to the synagogues and prisons, and you will be brought before kings and governors because of My name. 13 It will lead to an opportunity for you to witness. 14 Therefore make up your minds NOT TO PREPARE ahead of time, 15 for I will give you such words and a wisdom that none of your adversaries will be able to resist or contradict. 16 You will even be betrayed by parents, brothers, relatives, and friends. They will kill some of you. 17 You will be HATED BY EVERYONE hated by everyone because of My name, 18 but not a hair of your head will be lost. 19 By your endurance gain your lives.

  2. markmcculley Says:

    the arminian two step as heard in a pca church

    1. Jesus died for all your sins

    2. but you need to do more than assent to this, you need to trust this

    3. trusting this means not only that Jesus died for everybody, but you trusting that he died for you

    4. but if he died for everybody, and this means that he died for you, then you have only assented to it and not trusted

    5. it’s one thing to say the chair can hold you up, and another thing to sit in the chair

    6. so the chair holds everybody, but if you don’t sit in it, the chair holding you won’t be enough

    7. even the demons assent to the fact that the chair holds everybody, but the chair was not for demons but only for all humans

    8. so if you only assent to the fact that Jesus died for you, then Jesus died for all you but that won’t save you unless you trust it

    9. so you can’t trust in your assent, but you can trust in your trust

    10 the death of Jesus\ for you plus your trust in that (not only assent) will save you

    11. so remember, you don’t need to trust in order to know that Jesus died for you, but the death of Jesus for everybody will not save you unless you trust that Jesus died for you

    12 because obviously you could not trust that Jesus died for you unless we told you already that Jesus died for everybody

    13. so you don’t need to wait until you trust to know already that Jesus died for you

    14. but the death of Jesus still won’t save you unless you trust it and make it save you

    15 we should not talk about election, and even saying this is talking about election

    16. we should not talk about election, because it might people question if Jesus died for them and the gospel tells everybody that Jesus died for them, and there’s no need to wait to assent to that

    17 but assent to the death of Jesus for everybody is something different from saying that you needed Jesus to die for you and that you trust that Jesus did die for you

    18. of course Jesus did die for everybody but only those who know that they needed that will be saved

    19 the death of Jesus for sinners who don’t know their need and don’t trust is not enough to save them

    20 the death of Jesus for a sinner has nothing to do with the different sin of not needing that and not trusting that


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